I think it is a way for the US to say that if Civil War breaks out in Lebanon that the US will not allow Hizballah to overrun its allies. And that its gunships will be used to keep the balance. So in a way it’s a deterrent. However, in adds fuel to Hizbs claims to its followers that the March 14th leaders are US stooges.

The US has had battle groups in the Mediterranean and in the Persian Gulf for years. It’s a show of force and “message” more so than anything else. I don’t understand why everyone is getting all worked up about this.

Count on the Hezbos to use this to incite their herd of the willing and the malleable. Without an external threat they deflate like a balloon stuck with a pin since they don’t really seem to have anything that could be described as a credible program for running a government. I figure the noise level is going to go up though.

I still don’t understand why PM Saniora has to make a big scene about this, yet again trying to outdo the anti-US crowd, as if trying to prove himself to them. Why isn’t he making as big a scene when Syrian troops encroach on Lebanese territory and shoot 13-year old boys?

Come on guys…

If there is a civil war in Lebanon, the Americans learned from the 1980s that they can’t have troops on the ground. (refer to Army Barrack explosion killing 240 Americans)

They learned from Afghanistan that simply bombing the crap out of someone from 30,000 feet doesn’t work either. (refer to Osama and Ayman’s picnic in Bora Bora)

So what are these ships going to do? The Americans are known for their low accuracy shooting (refer to bombed out wedding celebrations in Iraq), so imagine if they try to bomb a Hezbollah base from their ships but hit a village full of civilians instead… do you think the Lebanese will accept that? I don’t think so either.

So, really, the Lebanese don’t want the Americans to meddle into their affairs, because it’s only the Lebanese that will lose.

Sorry Mus, I don’t buy your “mutual destruction” argument. It would be more like a “Lebanon destruction” “lose-lose” situation.

Like BV said why people are worked up over this because USA decided to shift a few destroyers. They’ve had the sixth fleet in the Mediterranean forever. I do not think US has any intention of meddling or interfering…This is a good chance for HA to ratchet up the rhetoric!!!

The message is for Bashar and his flunkies…

Seniora should either shut up or speak up against the occupation of downtown by the derelicts of HA. After all Aoun did say in yesterday’s interview that the tent city has achieved nothing!! He forgets of course billions of $$$ in lost revenues from the economy as well as los of revenue from tourists!!!

As I see, the problem is that the US cannot arm its allies in Lebanon the way Iran / SYria arm hezballah (i) because of Israel and (ii) it does not know in the hand of who the weapons will end. The boat is a middle ground.

But if civil war breaks in Lebanon, this boat may not be of much use because we will be dealing, if I am not mistaken, with urban warfare for the most part.

And oustaze Sami, before assuming you stand on the moral high ground, you should know that by a single reference to one accident of ‘collateral damage’ you will not prove anything to anyone over here. How many bomb hit their targets instead, do you have an idea? This is not prymary school buddy and no one but yourself will be convinced unless you show real cross country weapon type comparative statistics.

If you wanne shoot, shoot. Don’t talk.
.

The USS Nassau, an assault ship that usually carries a large contingent of Marines is reportedly empty. It is probably coming to help get UNIFIL quickly out of the harm’s way.

Sami,

Lose-lose = Mutual Destruction

Amir,

Wrong. The best wars are won by perception. Show your big guns and hope they’ll surrender without a drop of blood.

@PM Seniora,

I really don’t get Mr. Seniora’s ostrich reaction to the news.

There’s a LOT of stuff i “don’t get” from PM Saniora….The guy seems to be a complete idiot.

Mustapha,
Wrong. With holly fanatics it’s different. It is not enough to promise them blood; you have to show them blood.

It’s not enough to promise them you could turn their back-yards into “parking lots”. Only when they see it in their eyes, you get some quiet. And even this it for a limited period of time.
.

If there is a civil war in Lebanon, the Americans learned from the 1980s that they can’t have troops on the ground.

Wrong, Sami. The US learned from that that Lebanon is not a candidate for peacekeeping operations. If the US decides to send in ground forces to wipe out Hezbollah, Hezbollah is going to get wiped out. They have nowhere to run. But if that happens I expect Marines to be moved from Anbar in Iraq, not to be deployed from the sea.

I find it a bit puzzling that you think US forces are afraid of Hezbollah, after they’ve been taking on Al Qaeda and Taliban in Arghanistand and Iraq for years. The only thing the US fears in Lebanon is betrayal.

Now we’re getting really hysterical around here! Whoa! Guys! Slow down!

The Marines invading Lebanon? Taking out Hizbollah?

You folks actually believe the US is going to take military action in Lebanon? When the overwhelming majority of Americans is looking to withdraw from Iraq, in an election year?

Whatever it is you folks are smokin, it must be the good shit…

sami
“So what are these ships going to do? The Americans are known for their low accuracy shooting (refer to bombed out wedding celebrations in Iraq)”
Low accuracy?? no country in the world has spent more money and done more research on percision guided weapons than the U.S. the “bombed out weddings” your refering to had more to do with inteligence failures than bad aim.

“New TV has reported that more than 40 RPG 7 missiles were fired in addition to hundreds of rifles to celebrate the interview of Lebanon’s speaker Nabih Berri with ANB TV resulting in several injuries and property damage.”

Bunch of uncivilized savages. Must they fire in the air for INTERVIEWS too now? What next? Fire missiles when Nabih Berri farts or Hassan Nassrallah takes a dump? You expect me to sit down and “negotiate” with such uncivilized apes? These people don’t deserve a country, they’re animals.

BV,

You folks actually believe the US is going to take military action in Lebanon?

No, I don’t believe that. And even if I did, 1 MEU is insufficient to accomplish anything, anyway. The number of Marines these ships transport is the same number we had ashore in Lebanon in the early 1980s. It’s enough for an emergency intervention, but no more than that.

I’ve never thought that the correct way for the US to handle Hezbollah was in Lebanon. The correct way for the US to handle Hezbollah is to handle Iran, in my opinion.

But what Sami said was stupid, and provocative.

When the overwhelming majority of Americans is looking to withdraw from Iraq, in an election year?

Bush has nothing to lose. And US public opinion re: Iraq doesn’t translate into US public opinion re: Iran, Syria or Hezbollah. Those three are very much part of the War on Terror. Iraq never was.

Craig,

Understood. you were replying to a hypothetical situation (from Sami).

As for the second part. American public opinion is anti-war right now, period. They are not making that distinction between Iraq, Iran, Syria, or Hizballah. Trust me. Most Americans don’t look that far into the details. Right now, the mood is that we need to stop sending our boys to die elsewhere, for whatever reason.

Look at how Hillary and Obama have been using the whole “The Bush administration wants to attack Iran.” line as a fearmongering tactic. Trust me. Right now, any mention of military intervention anywhere will be frowned upon by the public.

RPGs?

I don’t think it’s far fetched if the firing of the RPGs were even ordered by the mafia-boss Berri himself.

This guy is so irrelevant now, having been reduced to a mere mailbox, must be feeling insecure. And we all know about men and their big guns. He needs to overcompensate!

Bush has nothing to lose, but he’d rather see McCain at the White-House that one of those two idiots the democrats are pimping.

Guys,

The USS Cole, “a guided missile destroyer”, is there for missiles if war erupts. I am not sure if it can protect Israel from Hezbollah missiles, but it can for sure stops the Syrians ballistic missiles.

“Syria has several hundred Scud model B, C, and D missiles, and perhaps a thousand SS-21 missiles”
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syria_and_weapons_of_mass_destruction

It is quite amusing to read the different views in the media about this matter.

Liberal ones have a nice heroic picture of the SS cole, while assafir has a picture of it when it was struck by a suicide attack.

I am against having the Americans in the Lebanese waters as much as I am against having the Iranian Revolution Guardians operating and terrorizing in Lebanon.

But between Iran and the States, I chose the less evil, which is the US.

Lebanon First, let’s be idealistic, utopia can help in times of crises!

This is depressing post.

Mus unwittingly equates M14 and M8 a la Aopun and Hezbo by saying :

“One is backed by Iran and Syria and the other is backed by the west…”

The crucial difference is one is for the state/law (with no success granted) and the other is trashing it.

The other depressing thing, besides Seniora sheer idiocy, is that while Berri’s thugs actions are decried here and on other blogs I fail to see one comment asking: where the hell is the army/state when these animals are shooting their weapons.

RPG under my office? Boycott that book fair in France damn it, and what the hell are the Americans doing in INTERNATIONAL waters respond the clown PM who does not even control his bowel movements.

Good post Mustapha.

You can talk and argue and counter argue as much as you want! Fact is the war is on the door and both parties led Lebanon to that point. Don’t go crying and weeping next, and blame it all on foreign powers. You created that mess! Suffer the consequences!

The point is Hezb doesn’t understand the language of rational conversations. They only believe in the language of force and war. So, their fate will be decided as such.
There is nothing Lebanese about Hezbollah’s tactics or intent. They are the ones threatening to destruct Lebanon. Why can’t they drop their weapons if we obtain international guarantees that Israel will never attack (which is a myth planted by Hezb.)

We don’t want a war with Israel-
get that through their thick Hezbos heads.

How can any American citizen accept a war in Lebanon against Israel?

You guys need to watch local American news.

How can any American citizen accept a war in Lebanon against Hezbollah? (oups)

You guys need to watch local American news.

But if the warships are merely for equilibrium, why is Saudi Arabia recommending to its citizens to leave Lebanon?

theCourtFool,

How can any American citizen accept a war in Lebanon against Hezbollah? (oups)

You guys need to watch local American news.

What do you mean by that?

you seem pleased mr. mustapha. has the arrival of these ships given you an erection?

Cole is here to f#$k somebody, thats for sure.
The intended people got horny very fast and started talking about erections.

A stock of vaseline arrived two days ago to Dahyieh and half of it is going to the south.
People in Lebanon are wondering why this sudden demand on Vaseline.
Rumors has it: “Some bearded guys felt suddenly horny”

vaseline is so yesterday. try ky jelly, it’s easier on your rectum

plus, last time i heard, it was tripoli and its environs that was the biggest per capita consumer of such lubricants

ali

You are nothing but a trash repressed homosexual who participate in the thugs manifestation and the destruction of civil propreties in Beirut.

Your award shall be a gun shot in your head (and not your ass). Or best way for you: One Way Ticket to your homeland Iran (land of bastards and respressed homos).

The US ships are in international waters and are just a symbolic balancing of the powers. A warning to outside influences not to interfere in internal politics of Lebanon.
Funny that Syria is so upset by their arrival, don’t you think?

MP Fadlallah: “Whoever links their fate to a battleship will go with the battleship” (Now Lebanon).

I fully agree with him.
.

sorry to burst your bubble Sam, but i aint in no bayroot. and i sure as hell aint goin to no eyeran to live either. repressed homo? is that the best you could come up with?

and what’s with the ‘gunshot in your head’? be civil.

sorry to burst your bubble Sam, but i aint in no bayroot. and i sure as hell aint goin to no eyeran to live either. repressed homo? is that the best you could come up with?

why did my post appear twice?

And the level of discourse, already at an all time low around here, just sunk another notch.

You guys all deserve what you have coming to you.

To those Hezbo lovers and opposition trouble-makers: Why is it OK for you to be Iran’s and Syria’s puppets, and not OK for the majority of Lebanese (as per last election) to have some sympathies with western nations and the rest of the arab world all-together?

[...] Beirut Spring, on the other hand, sees that the presence of the warship may create a balance between the two conflicting sides in the Lebanese political arena, which may then lead, in the end, to resolving the current deadlock: But who said anything about the US warships invading or bombing Lebanon? The USS Cole and the other ships coming soon to our neighborhood are just going to hang around. In fact, they’ll be so far we won’t be able to see them. But that doesn’t mean they won’t make a difference. Lebanon is divided into two, roughly equal groups that are struggling for power. One is backed by Iran and Syria and the other is backed by the west and the rest of the Arab world. Hezbollah had an advantage: It possesses an Iranian arsenal that it’s using for leverage in internal politics. The pro-westerns were being outgunned, and their American allies have decided to fix the situation by lending them some deterrence of their own. […] [...]

The US warships are messages of peace, understanding and reconciliation. Anyone who think that they intend to destroy anything is just delusional. They will be shooting flowers into Lebanon and occasionally, pots of honey.

Do not fear the US “Destroyers”, they will never use their weapons against Lebanese. Never have. Never will.

Nobody can destroy Hizbollah without destoying Lebanon. Hizbollah is more than a party, it is a population. Bringing US warships here will make Hizbollah stronger (its strength is propotional to the resolve of its supporters not to how much its member are being paid). The Shiites (including poor and uneducated) of Lebanon have to be accomodated by their Government (not by Hizbollah) and assured that they will no longer be treated as second class citizens which was historically the case. Only then will Hizbollah be a redundant entity. Any sane person will know that a US warship will not scare Hizbollah but give them more Arab support (by Arab I don’t mean Arab governments). The sooner Lebanese realize this the less pain they have to go through.

Maybe in the past the Shiites were treated like second class citizens. But today they are asking to be treated above and beyond first class. They don’t want to pay any electricity bills and they want electricity 24 hours 7 days a week. They don’t want to disarm and they want to occupy the center of Beirut, just for fun…
Maybe it’s time they consider moving down to first class.

Ya mustapha, Allah yo7shrak ma3 George W. Bush, and with the gunners of the american warships.

Nobody can destroy Hizbollah without destoying Lebanon.

I thought Hezbollah already destroyed Lebanon a long time ago? What harm could a little more destruction do, if some good comes from it… like the elimination of Hezbollah? Isn’t that was Hezbollah deserves?

As a Hezbollah supporter, you should be happy that the rest of the world wants to give the rest of Lebanon (the non-HA part) another chance. Because that is ALL that is saving your ass, right now. Those lies you tell yourself about people being afraid of Hezbollah’s “arms” are just that - lies. The Israelis have to be careful, because they have to be your neighbors for the forseeable future. Most of the rest of teh world doesn’t have any such concern, and Hezbollah really is a very small (but yappy) dog, in the big picture.

Happy Arab:
“Maybe in the past the Shiites were treated like second class citizens. But today they are asking to be treated above and beyond first class. They don’t want to pay any electricity bills and they want electricity 24 hours 7 days a week.”

That’s my point. Today they are treated better than before because of Hizbollah. Without guaranteeing their status in some form of constitutional change or amendment they are afraid that once Hizbollah is gone, it’s back to the good old days. So understanding what they really are afraid of is the key.

Craig:
“I thought Hezbollah already destroyed Lebanon a long time ago? What harm could a little more destruction do, if some good comes from it… like the elimination of Hezbollah? Isn’t that was Hezbollah deserves? As a Hezbollah supporter…”

The destruction that could happen to Lebanon is nothing compared to what already happened. What do you mean by elimination of Hizbollah ? There is nothing more painful than a perpetual civil war. Honestly how do you suggest eliminating a cause for a people by force instead of by conviction ?
Why are you assuming that I am a Hezbollah supporter! Is it just because I am trying to understand and elaborate their point of view ?

The real problem in Lebanon is that each Lebanese has a different identity of Lebanon. And unless they all sit down and openly try to define and agree on what Lebanon is or should be, Lebanon will always be a place that could easily be interfered with by outside players.

There is nothing more painful than a perpetual civil war. Honestly how do you suggest eliminating a cause for a people by force instead of by conviction ?

I wasn’t really talking about a Civil War, Blastercbi. I would object to the US (or any other outside power) getting involved in a Civil War in Lebanon. It wouldn’t really be a civil war, then. But Civil Wars historically DO end. The situation in Lebanon is an historical anomaly. I don’t know what the answer to that is.

What I was talking about is the restraint being shown by western powers. Hezbollah seems to think the west is afraid to intervene in Lebanon - afraid of HA. I don’t believe that’s the case at all. I believe the west (the US in particular) would relish a chance to go balls to the wall against Hezbollah. I think the only thing stopping it is fear of the consequences for the rest of Lebanon. A lot of people still have some hope that Lebanon can emerge a prosperous democracy at some point in the future.

the region with the most unpaid electricity is northern lebanon. quit bandying around these urban legends.

Craig, You are such an idiot. Folks here are crying to get out of Iraq and you are still talking war. Hey the Marijuana smoke has cleared, only a hang-over from the war party is left. But you are such a moron still high and buzzed thinking the US will go to war anywhere. Did you see what the economy is doing lately bozo, or where the deficit is?