Comments on: The Boutros Election Law http://beirutspring.com/blog/2008/02/26/the-boutros-election-law/ Blogging Lebanon since 2005 Thu, 09 Feb 2012 01:02:46 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Boutros Law Gets Two Powerful Backers | The Beirut Spring, a Lebanese Blog http://beirutspring.com/blog/2008/02/26/the-boutros-election-law/#comment-10417 Boutros Law Gets Two Powerful Backers | The Beirut Spring, a Lebanese Blog Tue, 06 May 2008 11:24:50 +0000 http://beirutspring.com/blog/2008/02/26/the-boutros-election-law/#comment-10417 [...] blog has long argued that the fairest election law out there is the one set up by the national electoral law [...] [...] blog has long argued that the fairest election law out there is the one set up by the national electoral law [...]

]]> By: Berri’s Doomed Plan - Part 2 | The Beirut Spring, a Lebanese Blog http://beirutspring.com/blog/2008/02/26/the-boutros-election-law/#comment-10416 Berri’s Doomed Plan - Part 2 | The Beirut Spring, a Lebanese Blog Fri, 11 Apr 2008 16:43:56 +0000 http://beirutspring.com/blog/2008/02/26/the-boutros-election-law/#comment-10416 [...] The best solution has been under our eyes for a long time, and we, the citizens, should be pushing for it now that the electoral law is pushed back to the front as an issue. We should all be part of the process, and we shouldn’t let the politicians take us for granted. [...] [...] The best solution has been under our eyes for a long time, and we, the citizens, should be pushing for it now that the electoral law is pushed back to the front as an issue. We should all be part of the process, and we shouldn’t let the politicians take us for granted. [...]

]]> By: Anonymous http://beirutspring.com/blog/2008/02/26/the-boutros-election-law/#comment-10415 Anonymous Fri, 29 Feb 2008 15:28:22 +0000 http://beirutspring.com/blog/2008/02/26/the-boutros-election-law/#comment-10415 Exactly, Stay silent! Exactly,
Stay silent!

]]> By: ali http://beirutspring.com/blog/2008/02/26/the-boutros-election-law/#comment-10414 ali Fri, 29 Feb 2008 01:39:03 +0000 http://beirutspring.com/blog/2008/02/26/the-boutros-election-law/#comment-10414 www.thewirelessmasters.com http://www.thewirelessmasters.com

]]> By: Bad Vilbel http://beirutspring.com/blog/2008/02/26/the-boutros-election-law/#comment-10413 Bad Vilbel Thu, 28 Feb 2008 05:17:38 +0000 http://beirutspring.com/blog/2008/02/26/the-boutros-election-law/#comment-10413 Oh. and just to prove how you debate in bad faith: In an earlier comment, when I said that Hizb is not capable of dropping their weapons and building a state, and they will use the "Israel bogeyman" excuse to keep their weapons, no matter the cost, you came back and said that I was full of hot air. Well, here you are, 2 comments later, saying: - begin quote <i>you really believe that since the israelis withdrew everything is hunky dory? i got news for you, there are many in israel, in the israeli government who view the northern border of israel as the litani river. and there are many in lebanon who are fine with that.</i> - end quote Isn't that the EXACT argument you got all indignant about, when I predicted you and your likes would always go back to "We have to keep our weapons because of the big bad Israeli bogeyman"??? Isn't it? Heh. Might want to try not contradicting yourself every 5 minutes. Oh. and just to prove how you debate in bad faith:

In an earlier comment, when I said that Hizb is not capable of dropping their weapons and building a state, and they will use the “Israel bogeyman” excuse to keep their weapons, no matter the cost, you came back and said that I was full of hot air. Well, here you are, 2 comments later, saying:

- begin quote
you really believe that since the israelis withdrew everything is hunky dory? i got news for you, there are many in israel, in the israeli government who view the northern border of israel as the litani river. and there are many in lebanon who are fine with that.
- end quote

Isn’t that the EXACT argument you got all indignant about, when I predicted you and your likes would always go back to “We have to keep our weapons because of the big bad Israeli bogeyman”??? Isn’t it?

Heh. Might want to try not contradicting yourself every 5 minutes.

]]> By: Krach http://beirutspring.com/blog/2008/02/26/the-boutros-election-law/#comment-10412 Krach Thu, 28 Feb 2008 05:16:16 +0000 http://beirutspring.com/blog/2008/02/26/the-boutros-election-law/#comment-10412 Freekin paranoid, how can they be so brainwashed to believe all this crap and argue about it. I always wondered if Hassan nasrallah was convinced deeply inside of the shit he keeps talking about. If he was a clever man, he should know that what he is saying is plain lies. If he thinks it's the truth than he is plain dumb. Ali, stop lying to yourself first! Look deep inside, you are not convinced of this shit you are saying. You know it! You know you are repeating what they taught you and that your own HUMAN logic refuses it. Lahads army was 80% shi3a if not more. Shi3a lived in peace with the israeli occupiers, shi3a were very happy with the israelis, shi3a got pissed that the israeli left the south to hezbollah. You say shi3a support hezbollah? Put down your guns and let's see how many will vote for you. Stop paying the shi3a Irani DOLLARS and we'll see how many will move their asses for you, how many will accept that you launch katiouchas from their veranda. I think you still have little time before lebanese loose their patience, and if that day arrive be sure that there will be no talking anymore and no one to listen to your silly record. Freekin paranoid, how can they be so brainwashed to believe all this crap and argue about it. I always wondered if Hassan nasrallah was convinced deeply inside of the shit he keeps talking about.
If he was a clever man, he should know that what he is saying is plain lies. If he thinks it’s the truth than he is plain dumb.
Ali, stop lying to yourself first!
Look deep inside, you are not convinced of this shit you are saying. You know it! You know you are repeating what they taught you and that your own HUMAN logic refuses it.
Lahads army was 80% shi3a if not more.
Shi3a lived in peace with the israeli occupiers, shi3a were very happy with the israelis, shi3a got pissed that the israeli left the south to hezbollah.
You say shi3a support hezbollah? Put down your guns and let’s see how many will vote for you. Stop paying the shi3a Irani DOLLARS and we’ll see how many will move their asses for you, how many will accept that you launch katiouchas from their veranda.
I think you still have little time before lebanese loose their patience, and if that day arrive be sure that there will be no talking anymore and no one to listen to your silly record.

]]> By: Bad Vilbel http://beirutspring.com/blog/2008/02/26/the-boutros-election-law/#comment-10411 Bad Vilbel Thu, 28 Feb 2008 05:11:12 +0000 http://beirutspring.com/blog/2008/02/26/the-boutros-election-law/#comment-10411 ali, I'm sorry you're incapable of conducting a fair debate with me. I did not dance around the subject. I agreed with you about shia griveances, and i offered a solution (ditching sectarianism). I even warned that those on the M14 side who think in sectarian terms risk taking us down this same path down the road, when Christians have similar grievances to the ones shia have today. I'm making a good faith attempt at discussing the issues with you, and you come back with platitudes and outright fallacies. The Shia are armed because no one protected them? That's the ONLY reason they are armed? You REALLY expect me to believe this? Hell, do YOU believe these lines yourself? You make it sound like the shia are the poor sheep and the rest of the Lebanese are the big bad wolf just waiting to devour your precious shia, were it not for those weapons. You forget that the rest of the Lebanese also suffered under Israel and under Syria for 30 years, apparently. But only YOU guys have the right to take up arms and defend yourselves? I'm done debating with you. You're not even discussing the same topics as me. You're off in some fantasy world. Good luck with that. The FACTS in the real world, go against half of what you're claiming. If we can't even agree on the ground facts, then trying to build a logical debate from there is totally moot. Thanks for playing, and I hope you have better luck in your fantasy world. ali,

I’m sorry you’re incapable of conducting a fair debate with me. I did not dance around the subject. I agreed with you about shia griveances, and i offered a solution (ditching sectarianism). I even warned that those on the M14 side who think in sectarian terms risk taking us down this same path down the road, when Christians have similar grievances to the ones shia have today. I’m making a good faith attempt at discussing the issues with you, and you come back with platitudes and outright fallacies. The Shia are armed because no one protected them? That’s the ONLY reason they are armed? You REALLY expect me to believe this? Hell, do YOU believe these lines yourself?

You make it sound like the shia are the poor sheep and the rest of the Lebanese are the big bad wolf just waiting to devour your precious shia, were it not for those weapons. You forget that the rest of the Lebanese also suffered under Israel and under Syria for 30 years, apparently. But only YOU guys have the right to take up arms and defend yourselves?

I’m done debating with you. You’re not even discussing the same topics as me. You’re off in some fantasy world. Good luck with that.

The FACTS in the real world, go against half of what you’re claiming. If we can’t even agree on the ground facts, then trying to build a logical debate from there is totally moot.

Thanks for playing, and I hope you have better luck in your fantasy world.

]]> By: Jay http://beirutspring.com/blog/2008/02/26/the-boutros-election-law/#comment-10410 Jay Thu, 28 Feb 2008 03:53:07 +0000 http://beirutspring.com/blog/2008/02/26/the-boutros-election-law/#comment-10410 Reading ali's replies gives us a glimpse of HA's school of thought. I find myself more empathetic toward M14 leaders who painstakingly attempt to dialogue with his like. An exercise in futility indeed! Reading ali’s replies gives us a glimpse of HA’s school of thought. I find myself more empathetic toward M14 leaders who painstakingly attempt to dialogue with his like. An exercise in futility indeed!

]]> By: Danny http://beirutspring.com/blog/2008/02/26/the-boutros-election-law/#comment-10409 Danny Thu, 28 Feb 2008 02:06:56 +0000 http://beirutspring.com/blog/2008/02/26/the-boutros-election-law/#comment-10409 ali, BV has articulated very clearly why your thesis is faulty. Here's a few other points; Fact: Lebanon was under Total Syrian occupation 1990-2005. Fact: HA had total freedom do do as they wished. Fact: Iztaz was in charge. Fact: Christians and Sunnis barely had freedom to voice an objection to Syrian Mukhabarati rulers who still happen to be HA patrons. Now tell me how the Lebanese government abandoned you..." no one bothered to care. S lebanon was a different world. so you think after the israeli withdrawal of 2000 the shia community is supposed to trust and rely on the lebanese government". How can you make that statement or argument with a straight face? Do you know how incredibly fake and hollow your argument sounds? I think you should rebel against those who kept the Shia down!(if that) ...you should rebel against the Syrians!!! So please let's stop the nonsence. As marillionlb put it: ENOUGH IS ENOUGH!!! ali,

BV has articulated very clearly why your thesis is faulty. Here’s a few other points;

Fact: Lebanon was under Total Syrian occupation 1990-2005.
Fact: HA had total freedom do do as they wished.
Fact: Iztaz was in charge.
Fact: Christians and Sunnis barely had freedom to voice an objection to Syrian Mukhabarati rulers who still happen to be HA patrons.

Now tell me how the Lebanese government abandoned you…” no one bothered to care. S lebanon was a different world. so you think after the israeli withdrawal of 2000 the shia community is supposed to trust and rely on the lebanese government”.

How can you make that statement or argument with a straight face? Do you know how incredibly fake and hollow your argument sounds?

I think you should rebel against those who kept the Shia down!(if that) …you should rebel against the Syrians!!! So please let’s stop the nonsence. As marillionlb put it: ENOUGH IS ENOUGH!!!

]]> By: ali http://beirutspring.com/blog/2008/02/26/the-boutros-election-law/#comment-10408 ali Thu, 28 Feb 2008 01:21:09 +0000 http://beirutspring.com/blog/2008/02/26/the-boutros-election-law/#comment-10408 again, you dance around the issue. the only reason HA is armed is that no one has ever protected the shia community. israel occupied S lebanon for over 2 decades. north of the litani it was business as usual. no one bothered to care. S lebanon was a different world. so you think after the israeli withdrawal of 2000 the shia community is supposed to trust and rely on the lebanese government? the same government that has been salivating for the chance to strike a deal with israel at the expense of the shia community? HA lays down its arms and the shia of S lebanon cease to exist. you really believe that since the israelis withdrew everything is hunky dory? i got news for you, there are many in israel, in the israeli government who view the northern border of israel as the litani river. and there are many in lebanon who are fine with that. again, you dance around the issue. the only reason HA is armed is that no one has ever protected the shia community. israel occupied S lebanon for over 2 decades. north of the litani it was business as usual. no one bothered to care. S lebanon was a different world. so you think after the israeli withdrawal of 2000 the shia community is supposed to trust and rely on the lebanese government? the same government that has been salivating for the chance to strike a deal with israel at the expense of the shia community? HA lays down its arms and the shia of S lebanon cease to exist. you really believe that since the israelis withdrew everything is hunky dory? i got news for you, there are many in israel, in the israeli government who view the northern border of israel as the litani river. and there are many in lebanon who are fine with that.

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