Comments on: The 10-10-10 Rears Its Ugly Head Again http://beirutspring.com/blog/2008/02/21/the-10-10-10-rears-its-ugly-head-again/ Blogging Lebanese politics, business and society since 2005 Wed, 23 May 2012 14:09:18 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.2 By: Bad Vilbel http://beirutspring.com/blog/2008/02/21/the-10-10-10-rears-its-ugly-head-again/#comment-10330 Bad Vilbel Fri, 22 Feb 2008 02:16:20 +0000 http://beirutspring.com/blog/2008/02/21/the-10-10-10-rears-its-ugly-head-again/#comment-10330 "Supposed to be a democratic country" ??? Let me stop you right there Danny. Lebanon never was a democratic country. And it certainly isn't nowadays. The very first precept of democracy is the respect for law and order and the state's institutions. ie: everyone agreeing to play by the rules, win or lose. Lebanon and the Lebanese people do not understand the meaning of Democracy (as the comments on this blog remind us every day). You guys think bartering at the point of a gun, and being a sore loser is "Democracy". Well it's not. “Supposed to be a democratic country” ???

Let me stop you right there Danny. Lebanon never was a democratic country. And it certainly isn’t nowadays.

The very first precept of democracy is the respect for law and order and the state’s institutions. ie: everyone agreeing to play by the rules, win or lose.

Lebanon and the Lebanese people do not understand the meaning of Democracy (as the comments on this blog remind us every day). You guys think bartering at the point of a gun, and being a sore loser is “Democracy”. Well it’s not.

]]> By: Danny http://beirutspring.com/blog/2008/02/21/the-10-10-10-rears-its-ugly-head-again/#comment-10329 Danny Thu, 21 Feb 2008 22:53:36 +0000 http://beirutspring.com/blog/2008/02/21/the-10-10-10-rears-its-ugly-head-again/#comment-10329 Krach, Forgetting about why we should not have any elections before its time...Let me ask you this question: Let's assume they agreed to a new law and elections happened. Also, let's assume March still maintained its majority...WHAT THEN??? Do you think for a moment that this theocratic party will become a democratic one? Do you think that old orangebutt will become patriotic and wise and forget about his idiocy??? WHAT THEN??? Krach,

Forgetting about why we should not have any elections before its time…Let me ask you this question:

Let’s assume they agreed to a new law and elections happened. Also, let’s assume March still maintained its majority…WHAT THEN???

Do you think for a moment that this theocratic party will become a democratic one? Do you think that old orangebutt will become patriotic and wise and forget about his idiocy???

WHAT THEN???

]]> By: Krach http://beirutspring.com/blog/2008/02/21/the-10-10-10-rears-its-ugly-head-again/#comment-10328 Krach Thu, 21 Feb 2008 22:23:53 +0000 http://beirutspring.com/blog/2008/02/21/the-10-10-10-rears-its-ugly-head-again/#comment-10328 Again, why not early elections? We don't want this president Sleiman being agreed upon, this is not democracy!!! they should be agreeing on a new electoral law if both parties has democracy survival in their minds, this is the only way there will be a solution. Election will show the true majority and the true majority votes for a president and the parliament chooses a new government. Enough wasting time, all this shit happening today is going to be reshuffled with the new elections next year, and until then we are still wasting time. Early Elections NOW!!! Again, why not early elections? We don’t want this president Sleiman being agreed upon, this is not democracy!!! they should be agreeing on a new electoral law if both parties has democracy survival in their minds, this is the only way there will be a solution. Election will show the true majority and the true majority votes for a president and the parliament chooses a new government.
Enough wasting time, all this shit happening today is going to be reshuffled with the new elections next year, and until then we are still wasting time.
Early Elections NOW!!!

]]> By: Bronx-man http://beirutspring.com/blog/2008/02/21/the-10-10-10-rears-its-ugly-head-again/#comment-10327 Bronx-man Thu, 21 Feb 2008 19:09:00 +0000 http://beirutspring.com/blog/2008/02/21/the-10-10-10-rears-its-ugly-head-again/#comment-10327 There is a phrase that makes the rounds that one doesn't need to talk to one's friends - only one's enemies - to solve problems. Along the same thread is that force alone cannot solve political problems. Nobody can fault Lebanon for not talking - and talking - and talking. Be careful that another observer of such situations, Carl von Clausewitz, doesn't have his approach tested again (and there are a lot of "agains") - that war is diplomacy by other means. The abyss is beckoning. There is a phrase that makes the rounds that one doesn’t need to talk to one’s friends – only one’s enemies – to solve problems. Along the same thread is that force alone cannot solve political problems. Nobody can fault Lebanon for not talking – and talking – and talking. Be careful that another observer of such situations, Carl von Clausewitz, doesn’t have his approach tested again (and there are a lot of “agains”) – that war is diplomacy by other means. The abyss is beckoning.

]]> By: Ace http://beirutspring.com/blog/2008/02/21/the-10-10-10-rears-its-ugly-head-again/#comment-10326 Ace Thu, 21 Feb 2008 18:51:07 +0000 http://beirutspring.com/blog/2008/02/21/the-10-10-10-rears-its-ugly-head-again/#comment-10326 Mustapha, You forgot to mention that when Aoun had his "stumble" after Hariri's bluff - he had to excuse himself from the room to make a telephone call for further instructions. He then returned with all the other conditions. I do believe the so-called opposition is no longer interested in the 1/3 +1 ... hasn't this now been increased to 45%? Mustapha,

You forgot to mention that when Aoun had his “stumble” after Hariri’s bluff – he had to excuse himself from the room to make a telephone call for further instructions. He then returned with all the other conditions. I do believe the so-called opposition is no longer interested in the 1/3 +1 … hasn’t this now been increased to 45%?

]]> By: MK http://beirutspring.com/blog/2008/02/21/the-10-10-10-rears-its-ugly-head-again/#comment-10325 MK Thu, 21 Feb 2008 17:13:40 +0000 http://beirutspring.com/blog/2008/02/21/the-10-10-10-rears-its-ugly-head-again/#comment-10325 Sami... Lebanon is the last place in the world you should be applying your coursework to. Sami…

Lebanon is the last place in the world you should be applying your coursework to.

]]> By: Mustapha http://beirutspring.com/blog/2008/02/21/the-10-10-10-rears-its-ugly-head-again/#comment-10324 Mustapha Thu, 21 Feb 2008 17:01:54 +0000 http://beirutspring.com/blog/2008/02/21/the-10-10-10-rears-its-ugly-head-again/#comment-10324 Sami, All what you said is nice. Unfortunately, that's not <a href ="http://beirutspring.com/blog/2007/05/01/how-the-lebanese-negotiate/" rel="nofollow">how the Lebanese negotiate.</a> Each side is trying to convince the other that their BATNA is war. Hardly a relief. Sami,

All what you said is nice. Unfortunately, that’s not how the Lebanese negotiate.

Each side is trying to convince the other that their BATNA is war.

Hardly a relief.

]]> By: Danny http://beirutspring.com/blog/2008/02/21/the-10-10-10-rears-its-ugly-head-again/#comment-10323 Danny Thu, 21 Feb 2008 15:46:02 +0000 http://beirutspring.com/blog/2008/02/21/the-10-10-10-rears-its-ugly-head-again/#comment-10323 Wow, Are we discussing something that makes sense? This is supposed to be a democratic country with its laws and constitution. What "basket" are you talking about? So if March 14 agrees to: **Aoun becoming President **HA keeping its weapons and its State **Giving March 8 (HA) 1/3+1 in cabinet shares **Let HA chose the army and ISF chiefs **Let Ha decide who can we be friends with..oops, only Iran & Syria Then we'll have a deal?? HA has been blocking this from day one. Everyone has their own axe to grind! What the hell were the elections for? All the rhetoric and posturing means nothing. We have idiots like "whatever" and his like who have nothing smart to say but criticize. For your dumb ass brain my oragette whatever, I have no hatred towards anyone... but disdain towards morons like you who do not understand any logic and keep on regergitating the same shit over and over again!! The main question should be: Are Lebanese and its parties ready to live in a democratic society with all its laws and institutions? If yes, then everyone puts down their guns and talk like civilized nations do!!Respecting of the constitution as it was written,and interpreted by Judges and Legal minds not according to interpretation of curbside vendors(Iztaz comes to mind)! End... Wow,

Are we discussing something that makes sense?
This is supposed to be a democratic country with its laws and constitution. What “basket” are you talking about? So if March 14 agrees to:
**Aoun becoming President
**HA keeping its weapons and its State
**Giving March 8 (HA) 1/3+1 in cabinet shares
**Let HA chose the army and ISF chiefs
**Let Ha decide who can we be friends with..oops, only Iran & Syria

Then we’ll have a deal??

HA has been blocking this from day one. Everyone has their own axe to grind! What the hell were the elections for?

All the rhetoric and posturing means nothing. We have idiots like “whatever” and his like who have nothing smart to say but criticize. For your dumb ass brain my oragette whatever, I have no hatred towards anyone… but disdain towards morons like you who do not understand any logic and keep on regergitating the same shit over and over again!!

The main question should be: Are Lebanese and its parties ready to live in a democratic society with all its laws and institutions?
If yes, then everyone puts down their guns and talk like civilized nations do!!Respecting of the constitution as it was written,and interpreted by Judges and Legal minds not according to interpretation of curbside vendors(Iztaz comes to mind)!

End…

]]> By: Sami http://beirutspring.com/blog/2008/02/21/the-10-10-10-rears-its-ugly-head-again/#comment-10322 Sami Thu, 21 Feb 2008 15:20:10 +0000 http://beirutspring.com/blog/2008/02/21/the-10-10-10-rears-its-ugly-head-again/#comment-10322 Mus, what is your source for the story about "Hariri looking at Aoun in his eyes and asking him..." Having taken Negotiations courses in the past, I can tell you that you can never reach a settlement if the whole negotiation is based on a single issue. The basic rule of negotiations is to add as many issues as possible to the negotiation table because each issue has a different level of importance and priority to each party. If the negotiation is focused on a single issue, then it becomes a game of power. When the 2 powers are equal, there is no settlement. Each party has an alternative to the settlement. The alternative is usually a worse scenario than the settlement. However, if they are willing to live with that alternative, then a settlement does not have to be reached. The only way to solve this is either: (1) Agree on a basket of issues or (2) Wait until there is an external factor which will render the alternative to a negotiated settlement an unacceptable situation. Until then, all things being equal, there is no solution. Mus, what is your source for the story about “Hariri looking at Aoun in his eyes and asking him…”

Having taken Negotiations courses in the past, I can tell you that you can never reach a settlement if the whole negotiation is based on a single issue.

The basic rule of negotiations is to add as many issues as possible to the negotiation table because each issue has a different level of importance and priority to each party.

If the negotiation is focused on a single issue, then it becomes a game of power. When the 2 powers are equal, there is no settlement.

Each party has an alternative to the settlement. The alternative is usually a worse scenario than the settlement. However, if they are willing to live with that alternative, then a settlement does not have to be reached.

The only way to solve this is either:

(1) Agree on a basket of issues

or

(2) Wait until there is an external factor which will render the alternative to a negotiated settlement an unacceptable situation.

Until then, all things being equal, there is no solution.

]]> By: whatever http://beirutspring.com/blog/2008/02/21/the-10-10-10-rears-its-ugly-head-again/#comment-10321 whatever Thu, 21 Feb 2008 15:09:29 +0000 http://beirutspring.com/blog/2008/02/21/the-10-10-10-rears-its-ugly-head-again/#comment-10321 I heard what you LF people said during 2006 summer war. Shame on you. You wanted Israel to deliver a "cadeaux" to you by eliminating HA and giving you the power again. Shame on you for wishing death upon other Lebanese. I heard what you LF people said during 2006 summer war. Shame on you. You wanted Israel to deliver a “cadeaux” to you by eliminating HA and giving you the power again. Shame on you for wishing death upon other Lebanese.

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