Comments on: Returning to Naher al Bared "As Symbolic As Returning To Palestine" http://beirutspring.com/blog/2007/10/10/return-to-nahrelbared-as-symbolic-as-returning-to-palestine/ Blogging Lebanon since 2005 Thu, 09 Feb 2012 16:14:48 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Suzanne http://beirutspring.com/blog/2007/10/10/return-to-nahrelbared-as-symbolic-as-returning-to-palestine/#comment-8033 Suzanne Mon, 15 Oct 2007 19:07:54 +0000 http://beirutspring.com/blog/2007/10/10/return-to-nahrelbared-as-symbolic-as-returning-to-palestine/#comment-8033 @Ghassan who said "Third, Palestinians in other countries are not allowed to be part of the local politics!" In Israel they are. The irony. @Ghassan who said “Third, Palestinians in other countries are not allowed to be part of the local politics!”

In Israel they are.

The irony.

]]> By: LebaneseArabPatriot http://beirutspring.com/blog/2007/10/10/return-to-nahrelbared-as-symbolic-as-returning-to-palestine/#comment-8032 LebaneseArabPatriot Thu, 11 Oct 2007 22:57:56 +0000 http://beirutspring.com/blog/2007/10/10/return-to-nahrelbared-as-symbolic-as-returning-to-palestine/#comment-8032 Just a quick historical and factual reminder here. The Palestinians were not given citizenship in ohter Arab countreis: Wrong ! They were given citizenship in Jordan and they contributed immensely to the Jordanian society, economy and well being. Now some smart guy will say: but they did not cause political chaos in Jordan ! Wrong again ! They PLO did threaten the monarchy of King Hussein and everyone heard of "Black September" and its events. Now Jordan was courageous enough to give them citizenship and they gave back immensely to that country. Jordan decided not to punish the Palestinians en masse for what the PLO leadership did. In Lebanon, we cannot find that courage yet. True the PLO participated in the civil war, but they were allied to Lebanese factions. It is completely not logical to punish the Palestinians for what their leadership did. Not to mention the religious discrimination in granting citizenship that Lebanon practices. If you're Christian (Armenian/ Palestinian/ Syrian) then you get citizenship, if you're muslim, Hell, you'll upset th "delicate sectarian equilibirum".At the end of the day, Palestinians are Arabs and their cause is just the least we could do is to offer them decent lives where they can work, buy property and be active in society. I personnaly would opt for giving them citizenship after getting rid of our sick mentality. Just a quick historical and factual reminder here. The Palestinians were not given citizenship in ohter Arab countreis: Wrong ! They were given citizenship in Jordan and they contributed immensely to the Jordanian society, economy and well being. Now some smart guy will say: but they did not cause political chaos in Jordan ! Wrong again ! They PLO did threaten the monarchy of King Hussein and everyone heard of “Black September” and its events. Now Jordan was courageous enough to give them citizenship and they gave back immensely to that country. Jordan decided not to punish the Palestinians en masse for what the PLO leadership did. In Lebanon, we cannot find that courage yet. True the PLO participated in the civil war, but they were allied to Lebanese factions. It is completely not logical to punish the Palestinians for what their leadership did. Not to mention the religious discrimination in granting citizenship that Lebanon practices. If you’re Christian (Armenian/ Palestinian/ Syrian) then you get citizenship, if you’re muslim, Hell, you’ll upset th “delicate sectarian equilibirum”.At the end of the day, Palestinians are Arabs and their cause is just the least we could do is to offer them decent lives where they can work, buy property and be active in society. I personnaly would opt for giving them citizenship after getting rid of our sick mentality.

]]> By: leo http://beirutspring.com/blog/2007/10/10/return-to-nahrelbared-as-symbolic-as-returning-to-palestine/#comment-8031 leo Thu, 11 Oct 2007 12:32:37 +0000 http://beirutspring.com/blog/2007/10/10/return-to-nahrelbared-as-symbolic-as-returning-to-palestine/#comment-8031 Snake the Jake @ #1 Stop fooling yourself. Yes, Lebanon allowed Palestinians in but then what happened? Why did you let them in if you had no intention of helping them? I understand when Israelis and Palestinians do not get along. Those two are sworn enemies. But when Lebanese are trying to portray themselves as 'Palestinian brothers' and at the same time treat those very Palestinians like dirt what exactly should Lebanese expect to happen? You know the answer to your problem: <i>"We offered sanctuary to the Palestinians for the past 60 years. Grudgingly perhaps, clumsily perhaps, and in imperfect </i>almost<i> <b>subhuman</b> conditions, yes!"</i> Sanctuary my ass. Stop whining and fix it already. Or keep doing what you had been doing, just stop whining. Snake the Jake @ #1

Stop fooling yourself.

Yes, Lebanon allowed Palestinians in but then what happened?

Why did you let them in if you had no intention of helping them?

I understand when Israelis and Palestinians do not get along. Those two are sworn enemies.

But when Lebanese are trying to portray themselves as ‘Palestinian brothers’ and at the same time treat those very Palestinians like dirt what exactly should Lebanese expect to happen?

You know the answer to your problem: “We offered sanctuary to the Palestinians for the past 60 years. Grudgingly perhaps, clumsily perhaps, and in imperfect almost subhuman conditions, yes!”

Sanctuary my ass. Stop whining and fix it already. Or keep doing what you had been doing, just stop whining.

]]> By: Andrew The American http://beirutspring.com/blog/2007/10/10/return-to-nahrelbared-as-symbolic-as-returning-to-palestine/#comment-8030 Andrew The American Thu, 11 Oct 2007 12:08:58 +0000 http://beirutspring.com/blog/2007/10/10/return-to-nahrelbared-as-symbolic-as-returning-to-palestine/#comment-8030 The Palestinians are beginning to realise how Israel felt / feels about "coming home" We'll see how much more they want to come home after 2000 years Gets cold out there doesnt it guys... And when you finally make it back to Jerusalem...will you be "Occupiers"? I didnt think so The Palestinians are beginning to realise how Israel felt / feels about “coming home”

We’ll see how much more they want to come home after 2000 years

Gets cold out there doesnt it guys…

And when you finally make it back to Jerusalem…will you be “Occupiers”?

I didnt think so

]]> By: Jester http://beirutspring.com/blog/2007/10/10/return-to-nahrelbared-as-symbolic-as-returning-to-palestine/#comment-8029 Jester Thu, 11 Oct 2007 05:38:56 +0000 http://beirutspring.com/blog/2007/10/10/return-to-nahrelbared-as-symbolic-as-returning-to-palestine/#comment-8029 Well said. Home for these Children and Families is in Palestine. Lebanon, as always has to pay the price of other peoples wars. Can Lebanon be the caretaker of others? Can we afford to take care of ourselves?? Where is Australia, Canada, New Zealand? They need immigration of about 12'000 (on average) a year... Well here they are! Well said. Home for these Children and Families is in Palestine. Lebanon, as always has to pay the price of other peoples wars. Can Lebanon be the caretaker of others? Can we afford to take care of ourselves??

Where is Australia, Canada, New Zealand? They need immigration of about 12’000 (on average) a year… Well here they are!

]]> By: the option not spoken http://beirutspring.com/blog/2007/10/10/return-to-nahrelbared-as-symbolic-as-returning-to-palestine/#comment-8028 the option not spoken Wed, 10 Oct 2007 19:31:25 +0000 http://beirutspring.com/blog/2007/10/10/return-to-nahrelbared-as-symbolic-as-returning-to-palestine/#comment-8028 Not a popular option (if you can call it that)... but anyway: 1) Give the option of tawteen to those with a lebanese link (eg, marriage) 2) Give the shebaa a new cool name like "North bank, land of rockets and AK47's" and move those not under (1) there, let UN handle the mess. 2.1) put the LAF on the new border :) now let's wait for the flames... Not a popular option (if you can call it that)… but anyway:
1) Give the option of tawteen to those with a lebanese link (eg, marriage)
2) Give the shebaa a new cool name like “North bank, land of rockets and AK47′s” and move those not under (1) there, let UN handle the mess.
2.1) put the LAF on the new border :)

now let’s wait for the flames…

]]> By: News Links : Outsider On The Inside http://beirutspring.com/blog/2007/10/10/return-to-nahrelbared-as-symbolic-as-returning-to-palestine/#comment-8027 News Links : Outsider On The Inside Wed, 10 Oct 2007 19:11:43 +0000 http://beirutspring.com/blog/2007/10/10/return-to-nahrelbared-as-symbolic-as-returning-to-palestine/#comment-8027 [...] Mustapha from Beirut Spring asks of the returning Naher El Bared refugees, what does home mean? [...] [...] Mustapha from Beirut Spring asks of the returning Naher El Bared refugees, what does home mean? [...]

]]> By: Danny http://beirutspring.com/blog/2007/10/10/return-to-nahrelbared-as-symbolic-as-returning-to-palestine/#comment-8026 Danny Wed, 10 Oct 2007 18:53:26 +0000 http://beirutspring.com/blog/2007/10/10/return-to-nahrelbared-as-symbolic-as-returning-to-palestine/#comment-8026 I think there is a consensus on this issue. The issue of lawlessness etc. was perpetuated by bribe taking Lebanese officials/politicians. Guns and mortar did not appear from the sky in ...1970...1975. Treating them with respect as they are in all the other countries, giving them all the rights of a citizen and also why not having them vote for their ex-officio representative with the Lebanese Parliament. As I said All Palestinians in the "civilized" world have become citizens of those countries! Is the right for return reserved for poor, depressed and deprived masses that live in Lebanon??? Treat them as equals... I think there is a consensus on this issue. The issue of lawlessness etc. was perpetuated by bribe taking Lebanese officials/politicians. Guns and mortar did not appear from the sky in …1970…1975. Treating them with respect as they are in all the other countries, giving them all the rights of a citizen and also why not having them vote for their ex-officio representative with the Lebanese Parliament. As I said All Palestinians in the “civilized” world have become citizens of those countries! Is the right for return reserved for poor, depressed and deprived masses that live in Lebanon???
Treat them as equals…

]]> By: Ghassan http://beirutspring.com/blog/2007/10/10/return-to-nahrelbared-as-symbolic-as-returning-to-palestine/#comment-8025 Ghassan Wed, 10 Oct 2007 17:57:08 +0000 http://beirutspring.com/blog/2007/10/10/return-to-nahrelbared-as-symbolic-as-returning-to-palestine/#comment-8025 Guys, Please don't blame to the Lebanese government and the Lebanese society/culture for that problems. First, the Palestinians in Egypt, Syria and other countries were not given citizenship! There are allowed to work, go to schools and live freely with limitations. Second, the Palestinians in other countries don’t have countries within the country and if they were caught with a pistol they will disappear!!! Look at Nahr Al-Bared before the recent fighting and look at Ein El-Helweeh, can a Lebanese Army go inside? Third, Palestinians in other countries are not allowed to be part of the local politics! Fourth, the PLO insisted on all Arab countries not to provide citizenship to the Palestinian refugees because the PLO was afraid that the “qadeia bi troo7” The cause will disappear!!! Last but not least, Syria during its occupation of Lebanon created disputes between the Lebanese and the Palestinian so it can use it anytime it wants!!! Now, what should we do? Palestinians should be allowed to work, go to schools, and own their own houses! At the same time, they should abide by Lebanon’s rules and regulations. No weapons, no checkpoints and no country within a country. Don’t like it, move to Syria. Sooner or later, the Palestinian problem will be solved and they will go back to their own country, Palestine!!!. Guys,
Please don’t blame to the Lebanese government and the Lebanese society/culture for that problems.
First, the Palestinians in Egypt, Syria and other countries were not given citizenship! There are allowed to work, go to schools and live freely with limitations.

Second, the Palestinians in other countries don’t have countries within the country and if they were caught with a pistol they will disappear!!! Look at Nahr Al-Bared before the recent fighting and look at Ein El-Helweeh, can a Lebanese Army go inside?

Third, Palestinians in other countries are not allowed to be part of the local politics!

Fourth, the PLO insisted on all Arab countries not to provide citizenship to the Palestinian refugees because the PLO was afraid that the “qadeia bi troo7” The cause will disappear!!!

Last but not least, Syria during its occupation of Lebanon created disputes between the Lebanese and the Palestinian so it can use it anytime it wants!!!

Now, what should we do? Palestinians should be allowed to work, go to schools, and own their own houses! At the same time, they should abide by Lebanon’s rules and regulations. No weapons, no checkpoints and no country within a country. Don’t like it, move to Syria.

Sooner or later, the Palestinian problem will be solved and they will go back to their own country, Palestine!!!.

]]> By: Don Cox http://beirutspring.com/blog/2007/10/10/return-to-nahrelbared-as-symbolic-as-returning-to-palestine/#comment-8024 Don Cox Wed, 10 Oct 2007 17:50:16 +0000 http://beirutspring.com/blog/2007/10/10/return-to-nahrelbared-as-symbolic-as-returning-to-palestine/#comment-8024 "Refugees" who were born in Lebanon should be full citizens of Lebanon. I often see Israel accused (wrongly) of apartheid. Isn't the situation of the "refugees" in Lebanon much nearer to apartheid? They are locked into living in certain areas (as the blacks in South Africa were), cannot work in most jobs, cannot vote, and so on. Is the vote the problem? It took a big struggle to get full voting rights for black people in the USA. "M" is right. “Refugees” who were born in Lebanon should be full citizens of Lebanon.

I often see Israel accused (wrongly) of apartheid. Isn’t the situation of the “refugees” in Lebanon much nearer to apartheid? They are locked into living in certain areas (as the blacks in South Africa were), cannot work in most jobs, cannot vote, and so on.

Is the vote the problem? It took a big struggle to get full voting rights for black people in the USA.

“M” is right.

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