No matter what we each say, we will continue trying to punch wholes in each other’s arguments. The bottom line is we both have very different opinions on many things, and as much as I respect your views, I think we’ll have to agree to disagree, or else this could go on forever. And frankly, I’ve spent too much time on this already, and I have better things to do. I’m sure you do as well.

All the best.

So, you’ve never met anyone who feels that Americans are “eternally evil”? And you come from where …???? I travel to Ottawa frequently and I can assure you I’ve encounterd that attitude many times – and from educated people who should know better. So either you’re being disingenuous or you don’t get out much. I hate to burst your bubble but that attitude is very prevalent in our oh so tolerant Canada.

And while we’re on the subject of tolerance, that would appear to be a one-way street for you. You accuse me of showing a “racist streak”. Geez – and you claim I make assumptions! I did not “lump all Muslims together”. Go back and read my post. I specifically referred to an “Islamist” mindset. In current political discourse, that term refers to Islamic terrorists not all Muslims. Of course, accusing people of racism is a time-honoured Leftie Canadian way of shutting down debate. However, I note you begin your post by derisively dismissing the fact that Israel belongs to the family of Western nations.

No, dude, I’m not kidding you. When you have a modern, open, forward-thinking democratic society, you are, by definition, part of the West. You would only dispute that definition if you’re one of those types that believes Zionism equals racism but can always be counted on to provide an alibi for anti-semitism.

So you see, my dear Mustapha, whoever you are, we Canadians are in no position to fix your house as our own is in such moral disarray.

Israel, part of “our Western world”? Are you kidding me?

When I brought up the UN, I was not making a comment about its effectiveness or non-effectiveness. In fact, I agree with you that the UN has become quite ineffectual over the years. Rather, I brought the voting record of its members. And it is this voting record which we can use as a coarse gauge for Israeli support throughout the world for its actions. It is pretty non-existent.

Yes, I am proud that Canada hasn’t actively supported the Israelis, and that makes me part of the VAST majority of the world that doesn’t condone Israeli actions over the past decades. The regional parties affected by this ongoing conflict (and in fact the entire world) know that international opinion is overwhelmingly against Israel. And were it not for American support (political, military, and economic), Israel would have had no choice but to ease back due to international pressure. Not only in this current situation, but in countless others in the past.

Again, don’t make assumptions. I have never met anyone who actually believes that “Americans […] are eternally evil” and I certainly don’t think that. I mean, come on! I DO see the US as being the “shining beacon on the hill”, and the rightful leader of the free world. Having said that however, they are not perfect, and I believe their handling of (and interfering in) Israeli-Palestinian politics has been atrocious, and has made things worse rather than better.

And damn! “I […] proudly support those defending that way of life against the medieval mindset of the Islamists.” Wow. You’ve shown your racist streak, loud and clear. Yes, some Islamists have a medieval mindset (every religion has its fundamentalists and its freaks), but you certainly can’t lump all Muslims together like that.

Historical triva questions:
What airforce that saved Jordan’s government by overflying Syrians tank columns in the 1980 when Yasser Arafat tried to take over Jordan?

Good Christ, you are so literal. When I said that Quebec was not part of Canada, I was referring to mentality not geography. I’m sure this Mustapha couldn’t care less about Canada’s internal politics but, since it touches on the “root cause” of the troubles in his own country, here goes. This mentality is certainly not exclusive to Quebec but it finds its spiritual home there. It has nothing to do with sovereignist/federalist or even English/French and you are apparently living proof it can exist outside of Quebec. It is a closed, elitist – one could say “tribal” mindset – that pre-determines the reaction to every event regardless of the facts on the ground. Every reaction is a knee-jerk response not a well-reasoned conclusion. In this worldview, the Americans and anyone who is allied with them are eternally evil. Coming from Ottawa which, geographically (and in other ways), is in the pocket of Quebec, you should recognize this way of thinking. It is the mindset that prides itself on not sticking up for the Israelis who are part of our Western world and defends the UN no matter how often it is revealed to be ineffectual and corrupt. It seems to me that Lebanon is similarly affected. Hence why I commented that Lebanon got itself into this mess by itself. At the end of the day, they would rather be anti-Israeli than pro-Lebanon. Until they rid themselves of this tribal mentality, all the “peace keepers” in the world won’t help their situation in the least. And, yes, for the record I am the descendant of “poor immigrant leeches” who got tired of living in the miserable bog of Catholic Ireland and yearned to live in the modern and open Western world. I, and I truly believe when push comes to shove, most other Canadians, proudly support those defending that way of life against the medieval mindset of the Islamists.

That country is… Lebanon! It has an army of 70,000 men. It has a duty to maintain the territorial integrety of its nation, meaning a duty to not allow a non-state militia to be running around and effectively co-opting Lebanese foreign policy.

All of the “reasons” I’ve heard until now as to why the Lebanese army “could not occupy southern Lebanon and control Hizbollah fighthers” have been excuses.

Israel had to do something very similiar to this within two months of it birth, when in June 1948, the provisional gov’t made the painful decision to take military action against the Irgun rather than allow it to continue as a distinct military force, apart from the IDG. After this point, taken during the dark days of Israel’s fight for its very existance, there were no separate Jewish militias running around – all military units became under the command of the Israeli government.

Of course, the Lebanese Army may need help in terms of logistics, air support, communications, etc. So *that* should be the role of any outside militaries – but not to interpose these outside groups in southern Lebanon – that will just insure a repetition of the 28-year failure of UNIFIL.