The art of getting on your nerves
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Monday, August 22
Thank you for visiting. If you like this post please subscribe to the Beirut Spring RSS feed to stay updated. (More..)
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The beirut spring is a blog that is interested in Lebanese society and its politics. It started in February 2005 after the assassination of Prime Minister Rafik Hariri
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August 22nd, 2005 at 11:27 am
I have decided to decide that this lunatic son of a bitch is a war criminal and a very dangerous ally for the Future movement.
Long live the “Confessional Federal Republic of Lebanon”. Christians are to elect their representative; and Muslims are to elect theirs. Lebanon will survive this way. Stupid ass heads as Jumblat will know it soon enough.
PS: Please do not consider these rude words as insults. It is merely about descriptive analysis.
August 22nd, 2005 at 11:56 am
Il est fort tout de même ce Johnny Abdo !!!
Il les a bien manipulés.
August 22nd, 2005 at 12:55 pm
Mustapah, the man effectively said that the majority coalition in parliament will select the next Lebanese President. I don’t see anything scandalous about his assertion.
However, there is a major inconsistency. When Berri was the man who was fighting for his job, Jumblatt said that the Shi’a will nominate candidates for Speaker, and the Lebanese Parliament will accept or regect the nomination. I’m curious to see whether Jumblatt is contradicting that traditional separation between nomination and election, or whether he means to break it down.
If Jumblatt means to break the tradition and impose the “Muslim” will on the Maronites, he will definitely fail. If, on the other hand, he aims to follow normal practice, then the words he uttered yesterday were simply theatrics, without any political significance.
August 22nd, 2005 at 1:18 pm
Hey Mustapha -
Is it true that you like Photoshop? (smile)
barney
August 22nd, 2005 at 3:00 pm
What is incredible in this country is that two communities vote for the same persons (Jumblat and Hezbollah) whatever the issues. This is incredible. A diversity of political movements shows some level of thinking but sheep behaviour is definetely not a sign of intelligence.
August 22nd, 2005 at 4:34 pm
This guy just cracks me up. It’s true raja, in a democracy, the majority elects who they want … but there are some issues in lebanon that have to be taken into consideration. You can’t jump from being a government that is (well, meant to be) represantative of the sects, to that of being what a democracy is. It might be seen as a brave step to take us in this direction, but I think we all know that Jumblatt didn’t do this because he was brave.
And . . . his statement has already begun to annoy (being euphimistic here) some people. There are other issues that we have to solve before saying things like this …
August 22nd, 2005 at 4:52 pm
I must be missing something but I do not know what is so scandalous about what Walid Jumblatt said.
Love him or hate him, Jumblatt has a certain level of seniority, status, popularity in the press and populace etc.. Also he is riding the anti-Syria wave that he jumped on comparatively early. All these things give him stature. He also has a lot of behind the scenes influence on the other political parties. So if he wants to say what he said there is nothing wrong or scandalous about it..
He basically said “A majority of parliament will look to elect the next president.” nothing wrong with saying that. Am I missing something?? Or is it just pent up anti-Jumblatt hate?
August 22nd, 2005 at 6:18 pm
Lazarus, the last part of my comment tried to deal with the additional sectarian variable that we have to consider when we talk about sectarian majorities or minorities. The Berri mess was solved when people were reminded of the tradition (which I never knew existed by the way) of sectarian nomination and national approval. But skepticism aside, and taking into consideration Lebanon’s sectarian system, I think that the tradition is acceptable for the moment. The sect nominates its candidates and the entire country votes to accept one of them - hence national coexistence.
If Jumblatt wants to break with a system that he personally propped up during the Berri mess, then he’ll be a hypocrite, and a pretty lousy one at that. If on the other hand, he plans to move forward with this system in mind, then there was simply no point to his statement except to ruffle some feathers - which, in my opinion, was classic Jumblatt but very stupid.
Anyways, my point is that (believe it or not) there appears to be a strong system in Lebanon. Moreover, the Maronite community is not just going to role over and become a political nonentity. This will pass.
August 22nd, 2005 at 6:27 pm
I would think that having certain slots in government reserved for specific sects is bad enouegh, but then also having that specific sect choose the person to fill the slot. Makes things even worse..
I think Lebanon should move away from that. And the first step is what Jumblatt is pushing for. Maybe he is not the best person to be starting this conversation but he can make a lot of noise. But on the other hand his position switching and hypocracy does not help.
August 22nd, 2005 at 8:48 pm
First of all ramzi, let me remind you that the parliament was elected under an unfair electoral law. Moreover, the statement of Jumblat is intented to enflame the public opinion and nothing more.
Jumblat is trying to exclude Aoun from the process - I don’t like Aoun but excluding him from the presidential elections is equivalent to excluding the christian community. You should known that excluding a community undermines everything in Lebanon: the economy, the political ‘jaw’ etc… This is bad news for everybody. For better and worse, Christians chose Aoun in 2005. He will remain in this role, at least until the next elections in 2010.
There’s an important issue that needs to be clarified in Lebanon :hould the ‘presidents’ be representative of their community or the whole country? I don’t care about the answer as long that it applies to ALL presidencies which is not the case currrently.
August 22nd, 2005 at 8:57 pm
Mustapha, great shot. I agree with all of the above
August 22nd, 2005 at 9:28 pm
I don’t agree with the opinion that the Christians in parliament who worked with Harriri and Jumblatt are any less representative of Christians then those in Aoun’s block. I find it very disheartening that those Christian leaders who found common ground with Jumblatt and Hariri are being ostracized by their community.
Aoun took advantage of Hariri and Jumblatt’s blunder in sticking with the old election law and their support of Berri to rally Christian voters around him and label Christians in the Jumblatt/Hariri camp as puppets.
Maybe with the return of Geagea to Lebanon he will be a strong Christian voice to counter this puppet label.
It is very unfortunate Harriri and Jumblatt didnt accommodate Aoun instead of Hizb/Amal. I think they and Aoun both share in the blame.
August 23rd, 2005 at 9:40 am
Attacking Aoun, directly or indirectly, is not a mean for some noble political aim but an aim by itself. Just after the “tsunami” alarm Jumblatt gave after 14th of march, the political attacks against Aoun became regular and nerve wrecking and this new presidency thing is only one of these many attacks. Jumblatt’s main aim is to keep any possible “rapprochement” between the Future Movement and Aoun impossible. These two movements are, in my opinion, the ones that have the most compatibility potential, both having big bases with no extremist thoughts (religiously) and this kind of link, which was obvious during the downtown Freedom Camp, threatens Jumblatt. I can’t blame the FM or LF for being allies with an important figure which in the end represents an important part of the country, however i worry that Joumblatt will keep on brainwashing their bases and drawing them into fights against Aoun, fights which will prevent any possible change or improvement in the country.
August 23rd, 2005 at 4:43 pm
Patriotic, I agree with much of what you say. But didn’t Jumblatt as early as 2004 work to bring Aoun back to Lebanon. And wasnt Aoun the one who started the first salvo with his speach upon arrival in Beirut?
Aoun taking credit for the Syrian withdrawel, his maneuvering for the presidency, his support for Lahoud and alliances with some of the most hated ProSyrians. These are actions by Aoun that did not endear him to Hariri or Jumblatt.
August 23rd, 2005 at 7:46 pm
Jumblat has always played the hard-line talker instead of FM. The Future Movement tone and that of Martyr Haririr has always been:
Moderation NOT arrogance
Flexibility NOT Extremism
Reason NOT Fanatism
TOLERANCE NOT violence
Jumblat was the perfect ally to Martyr Hariri…. In coordination with Martyr Hariri Jumblat has always played the hardline speech.
I dont see his speech and the tactic today of FM any different than what it used to be before:
FM: Talk and Negotiate
Jumblat: Hardline talker
This strategy of good cop - Bad cop has always worked and it will work with Jumblat - FM
August 23rd, 2005 at 7:49 pm
Ramzi,
you are right about aoun.. and not to forget the famous slogan:
“When we ally, we ally on a program and not on seats” yea right..
:)
August 24th, 2005 at 5:29 am
Ramzi, I am not saying that the LF have no legitimacy - I favour anybody who’s favorable to a federation. I did not forget that Aoun was elected under special circumstances. But this is not the point. The point is that excluding the elected reprsentative of the the christian community is a dangerous precedent (excluding the peoriod of the Syrian occupation) and is an open and obvious provocation from Jumblat.
Jumblat is trying to create tensions between christian opposition and the FM, let us not fall for his cheap tricks.
August 24th, 2005 at 9:42 am
The good-cop bad-cop strategy khaled mentioned is very interesting, whether it is deliberate or not, and sure seems to be working for both of these parties, however not so well for the rest of the country. Thank you for the words “Moderation, Flexibility, Reason and Tolerance” which i failed to find in my previous post to describe the similarity between the FPM and FM way of thinking.
As for the “who started it” question (which i truely dislike), as i see it Ramzi, Jumblatt’s “here comes the tsunami” is what started the problems even before Aoun’s arrival, and i remember it well since this was the first deep wound we got after 14th of march. Then Jumblatt denies,as always indirectly, Aoun from any credit in the liberation of the country, waits Aoun’s defense then manipulates it to make it look as if Aoun is taking Hariri’s death lightly. Jumblatt knows that such words would cause problems with Aoun but thats the whole point isnt it?! All the other events just became cause/effect from the lack of trust.
Sorry, I know my words might be biased but these words come from a big shock the FPM got after defending the PSP everywhere and telling other parties to give Jumblatt a chance when he switched back to the opposition, but all this trust was suddenly just another disappointement and Jumblatt does not seem to be ready to stop any time soon.
August 24th, 2005 at 10:28 am
Patriotic,
It is not who started it, it is rather the fact that there is personal hatered between GMA and Jumblat, here is an analysis I made during the election:
(PS I did not say in it why Jumblat Hates GMA, but in my opinion it is again personal)
The issue wit Jumblat and GMA is personal, GMA mentioned this it in many occasions…
GMA’s increasing hatred towards Jumblat is based on the following:
a. It all started in Paris, when Jumblat met GMA in France, Jumblat considered the visit as a social one, while GMA expected it to be a political meeting after which Jumblat should have declared that GMA is the hero of the opposition, and he expected Jumblat to say (NATREENAK General)….. Jumblat NOT discussing any political issues with GMA, and not portraying GMA as the hero…. Ma 3jabito el issa………
b. Jumblat being the apparent head of the opposition, with meetings with world leaders (Russia, KSA, France, etc….) bothered GMA as GMA believed that he should be heading the talks with these international leaders.
c. Jumblat the smart “ele bishem” knew before hand that GMA was coming back to Lebanon expecting to lead the opposition, and enforce his rules… and hence came the famous word Tsunami. ya3ne Jumblat meant that GMA was going to say “zeho ya mo3arda tekleed we khaleene ana el mo3arad el aslieh ik3od mahalkon….. lak GMA even diminished the role of the martyrisim of late PM Hariri
d. Jumblat Did not meet GMA at the airport, and not participating in the hero’s return, made GMA even angrier.
e. GMA expected the 2000 elections law to be modified, which if it were, it would have suited his electoral grounds better. GMA considers Jumbalt as the master mind behind allowing the 2000 law to pass.
f. When negotiations started, again GMA wanted to be treated as the leader of the opposition and started asking for number of seats based on the Cada law; but he was faced with Jumblat who informed GMA that his size on the ground does not reflect what he is asking for (hence elections polls were asked)
g. and last but not least is Souk el Gharb, the battle and the assassination attempt on GMA at the entrance of Souk el Gharb
August 24th, 2005 at 3:34 pm
You will all accuse me of heresy
But i just happen to know the facts and cannot reveal my sources
But i hope this you will consider that point (at least by subliminal suggesting)
Jumblat is a Zionist agent. Wait and see. (And f*** his dirty false arabist stance). Wait and see…
His relations with ultra-zionist israeli druzes in no secret to anyone (except to stupid pseudo-leftist lebanese) here and everywhere
August 24th, 2005 at 4:30 pm
Yea right Kadorie
How can someone be a Druze and a Zionist, even if they were Isarelis ? I thought that one of the pre-requisits of being a Zionest was being a jew….
August 24th, 2005 at 4:56 pm
Patriotic, on the “who started it” question I would have to agree with Khaled’s post above, that things probably fell apart during the Jumblatt and Aoun meeting in France. It could very simply be that the opposition cannot handle two super-egos; Aoun and Jumblatt.
From Jumblatt’s position he probably felt that he took the super risk by rebelling against the Syrians inside Lebanon and thus deserves the right to lead the opposition.
Aoun on the other hand thought since he was working against the Syrians from day one he should be leading the opposition. Unfortunately for Aoun he was living in France for those 15 years. A big disadvantage.
Instead of joining together Aoun and Jumblatt locked heads, and they both ended up damaged. Aoun is now just another Christian leader and Jumblatt lost the national popularity he gained during the last year. Too bad for them, I am not shedding a tear. And in the end the big loss is to Lebanon which would have benefited from a still united opposition.
August 24th, 2005 at 5:04 pm
Kadorie, you should grow up and base your logic in fact instead of the anti-Jumblatt and probably anti-Druze hysteria that you get from your mommy and daddy. The only thing I am going to “wait and see..” as you say. Is when are you going to grow up and start thinking logically?? Until then your baseless rants are not helping any discussion.
“I just happen to know the facts and cannot reveal my sources.” How many times have we heard that before?
August 24th, 2005 at 9:38 pm
You have christian zionist, y not druze zionists?
Israeli druez volunteered to join the IDF by the way.
Anyway it’s a secret to no Bhamdoun inhabitant that Israeli druzes fought along PSP against LF in 83.
August 24th, 2005 at 9:43 pm
Ramzi, I wonder if we should talk about super-idiots rather than super-egos…
cheap shot… but I feel great saying this.
August 24th, 2005 at 11:23 pm
You cant be guilty by association. i.e. just because you are a Druze leader and there are Druze in Israel that joined the IDF. Does that mean that you are a pro-zionist? No.
Also that allegedly some Israeli Druze joined the fight against the LF? Maybe so. For the small Druze community it was a matter of survival. So it is very possible that some Druze living in Israel (and in Syria for that matter) joined to help fellow Druze in the mountains.
So I still do not see any fact to convince me that Jumblatt is a Zionist.
The Druze in Lebanon that I know are very upset with Israeli Druze in the IDF. They know that can only bring a negative backlash for the Druze living in Syria and Lebanon.
But let’s not just restrict our talk to Druze shall we. What about the Israeli Muslim laborers building the houses in the Israeli west bank settlements?? You can find Israeli collaborators in every religion.
August 25th, 2005 at 12:50 am
fact #1: Druze don’t volunteer to join the IDF. They are drafted.
fact #2: Circacian Muslims are also conscripted
fact #3: Beduin Arabs form the largest non-Jewish body of Israeli soldiers - and they volunteer to serve.
August 25th, 2005 at 12:58 am
Raja, the druze are drafted true but they are the only ‘Israeli arabs’ who are accepted in the Israeli army. Even palestinians christians are not drafted. Anyway the And that for a simple reason: the druze community itself asked for this. This is not a conspiracy theory, this is a very open fact. Just google the web.
Not that I am not talking about the druze living in Golan. These ones refused the Israeli citizenship. IMHO, it’s because they know that they are going to reintegrate Syria one of these days.
August 25th, 2005 at 1:01 am
For the record, I never said that Jumblat was a sionist, these are not my comments. I just said that he was helped by Israeli druzes.
August 25th, 2005 at 1:16 am
vox, I am not challenging your facts. All I am doing is adding some new ones. Very few people know the whole story, and Druze Israelis carry the brunt of “Arab” Ire with regards to the issue of serving the Israeli Army. Had the Circasian community been a bit larger, people would have noticed them. As for the Beduin, there is simply no excuse. They form the majority of Arabs in the Israeli Army. They willingly volunteer - i.e. they go and ask to serve. They constitute the majority of the Israeli Border Guards, and therefore clash with the non-Israeli Palestinians regularly. And finally, they also serve as officers. I remember one scandal a few years ago where a beduin Colonel in the Israeli Army was charged with buying drugs from Hizballah during the occupation and distributing his “goods” in Israel. Again, I am not disputing your facts, I am merely complementing them with some of my own.
August 25th, 2005 at 1:57 am
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